Virginia Lamb

Virginia has lived in Eldersberg since 1936. She shares about her family history and what her childhood was like growing up in Carroll County.

Transcription

ANN HORVATH: OK. Today is April 22, 2009. We’re in Eldersburg at the home of Virginia Lamb. My name is Ann Horvath, and John Foertschbeck is on the camera. Mrs. Lamb, how long have you lived in Eldersburg?

VIRGINIA LAMB: 1936.

ANN HORVATH: OK. And your family, can you tell me a little bit about your parents?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, my mother was a Grimes, on Old Washington Road. They had a farm on Old Washington road. The farm’s still there. My father, well, went from South Dakota.

But other than that, I can’t say too much about him till they came here, when he was a kid. And then his father passed away. And there were four, four boys. I think he died of lung– black lung? Was it called black lung?

Yeah, there was some–

In those days, black lung. I think that’s why he passed away.

How come he was born in South Dakota?

I don’t know where he was born.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know where he was born.

ANN HORVATH: But his mother or father, tell me if–

VIRGINIA LAMB: My grandmother was from Rapid City, South Dakota.

ANN HORVATH: OK. And What was your father doing there– or, your grandfather, there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Worked in mines– gold mines, I think. They had a 2,200 acre ranch in Rapid City. And they sold it. When he got sick, they came to Maryland. Now, whether he was from Maryland, originally, I don’t know. I don’t know that.

ANN HORVATH: Many of the Harris’ were miners.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: But you think this is a gold mine?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I think. I think it was a gold mine.

ANN HORVATH: How did he meet his wife?

VIRGINIA LAMB: In a restaurant. She was a waitress or cook.

ANN HORVATH: And then they came to Maryland.

VIRGINIA LAMB: They came to Maryland–

ANN HORVATH: And they got sick.

VIRGINIA LAMB: –in a covered wagon.

ANN HORVATH: With how many children?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Four.

ANN HORVATH: Four children.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Four boys. Four boys, yeah. Darrell, Bill, James, and Herman.

ANN HORVATH: OK. And so, then your father stayed here?

VIRGINIA LAMB: He went in the Navy at 17.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I do know that.

ANN HORVATH: And you grew up here, then, in Eldersburg?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I grew up in Gist.

ANN HORVATH: In Gist? OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And the roads were mud, then. So then we moved to Eldersburg so we wouldn’t have to walk through the mud.

ANN HORVATH: Where did you start school? Where did you start school?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Sykesville. ’36.

ANN HORVATH: Sykesville?

VIRGINIA LAMB: 1936.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Was there a school in Gist?

VIRGINIA LAMB: My mother went to school. And the little brick school house is still there on the corner of Bartholow and Klee Mill. She went to school there. And walked, through the mud, again.

ANN HORVATH: And dust.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Dust, rain, snow, you know.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Did your family attend one of the local churches?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Years ago they did, yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: But my father never– wasn’t, no. He didn’t go to church.

ANN HORVATH: What kind of work did your father do?

VIRGINIA LAMB: The church that they went– I think my mother might have went to Harmony Grove.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know that little church on Klee Mill?

ANN HORVATH: Klee Mill Road?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I think, yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Harmony Grove.

ANN HORVATH: What kind of work did your father do?

VIRGINIA LAMB: He was a carpenter, a painter, a wallpaperer, most anything, he could do. He was handy. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: And where did you live here, in Eldersburg, then, with the family?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Up here in the middle of Eldersburg on 26.

ANN HORVATH: Right on 26?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Is the house still there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. No. All the houses are gone. I think there was 10 there, at one time.

ANN HORVATH: There were a lot of little homes right there.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And you remember the places on the corner? Like the station?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, Lions’ Lunchroom. And there was Johnny Ruby’s house.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Selby.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: [INAUDIBLE], Nick, and Mrs. Ethel Selby. And then there was Bevard house, which the Conaways lived there. Bill lived there. And then it was a double house, was Bevards. Then my house, where we lived.

And then Baisman. And there was a little bungalow that my father owned at one time. Then there was a double house that my Uncle Bill owned at one time. And then it was Kricker’s on the end. And then Dr. Lawson’s house was the next big house.

ANN HORVATH: Where did you get your groceries?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Walt Frizzell’s store in Eldersburg.

ANN HORVATH: Where was that? Right in Eldersburg?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, see where it is now. Where Walgreens–

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Walgreens.

ANN HORVATH: On that corner.

VIRGINIA LAMB: See, the Conaway garage is where Walgreens is. And then the next door was Walter Frizzell’s– Walter Frizzell’s store.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Those were those little houses that were real close to the road?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yes. Oh, yes. Walk right up to the front door. I had to walk right on Liberty Road. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: So that’s where you got your groceries.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: You went to school, though, in Sykesville.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I think a loaf of bread was $0.11. If I remember, I think a loaf of bread was $0.11. And it was a quart of milk. I forget what that was. Anyway, when there was a nickel, we’d come out with five pieces of candy.

JOHN: Can’t do that anymore.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No, you can’t do that. No. And then, Lions’– well, see, Lions’ Lunchroom was on the other corner first. And then they moved to the newer one that I showed you in the book here.

ANN HORVATH: We’ll look.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Did you go to the Lunchroom often?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Yes. It was a nickel or a quarter or a dime. Get you a TruAde.

ANN HORVATH: Get a TruAde, yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Played jukebox.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Slot machine, you know.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. So that was a place of entertainment for the kids?

VIRGINIA LAMB: That was entertainment.

ANN HORVATH: What other kinds of things did you do as a kid?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, we’d go to Sykesville, to movies. On Saturday, we’d go there. But what I did, when we were younger, we’d ride our bikes to Springfield and watch the movies on Saturday, up in the auditory.

ANN HORVATH: On the second floor?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. They had a big–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. After we had our graduation, when we graduated, it was up on top floor. Yeah, we rode our bikes down there. Western movies.

ANN HORVATH: Western movies, sure.

JOHN: How do you remember doing things like that?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I was a little scared.

[LAUGHTER]

And then I ended up working there 35 years.

JOHN: Oh my goodness.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And the patients would come and watch the movies, too.

VIRGINIA LAMB: That’s what it’s for, the patients, yeah.

ANN HORVATH: But the neighborhood came in?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. They let us come in. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: So you worked at Springfield for-

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: What kind of job?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I went in nursing, at first. And then I transferred to housekeeping. They put me on night shift. Cathy was 3 and Robin was 10. And they put me on night shift. And I just couldn’t work night shifts. I transferred to housekeeping.

ANN HORVATH: Where did you meet your husband?

VIRGINIA LAMB: [INAUDIBLE].

ANN HORVATH: Mhm.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You heard of [INAUDIBLE]?

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Where was it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Go to Taylorsville, make a left. It’s still there. It’s still there. $0.50 to get in.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. Ah. There was a community meeting place for the young people.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Packed. Packed. The old building would rock. I mean rock! It would move!

ANN HORVATH: They held dances there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: And they had local bands come in.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh. It would move! The building would move. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: All right. [LAUGHS]

VIRGINIA LAMB: It sat on– you know, it sat on these big– you know?

JOHN: All right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah.

JOHN: You get in there, jumping.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Outside restroom, you know.

[LAUGHTER]

ANN HORVATH: And the place is– the parking lot would be full of cars.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Packed, packed, packed.

ANN HORVATH: Was it mostly Saturday night?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, at one time, before I was old enough to go to dances, they had them on Tuesdays. But then, when I got older, they had them on Thursdays and Saturday.

ANN HORVATH: Thursdays?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

JOHN: So you went there whenever you could?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. I generally went on Saturday.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Did you ever go to Strawbridge for any of that?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I went to Strawbridge for a Halloween party one time. One of the boys asked me to go out with him, you know, tea party. That was the only time I was ever out there. But it was nice, you know. They had it for the boys. A lot of nice guys. A lot of nice guys from Strawbridge.

JOHN: Like me.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Were you from Strawbridge?

JOHN: No.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You never know! You never know.

ANN HORVATH: Where did your grandparents live?

VIRGINIA LAMB: My mother’s mother and father lived on Old Washington Road. The farm is still there.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. What about the people who lived on Linton Road?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No, they didn’t live on Linton Road. It’s the farm above Linton Road, on the right.

ANN HORVATH: OK. In that farm, yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: 282 acres. I don’t even know if it was on the road or not. The house is way, way back.

JOHN: Yeah. I’d have to go back and check the house, then.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I got a picture of it.

ANN HORVATH: OK. You’ll have to show us.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Did you get to visit the farm very often as a child?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes, yes, yes. I liked it over there, really did.

ANN HORVATH: Did you have chores when you were there, or?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, I fed the chickens. And gathered the eggs and all of that, you know, when I was a kid.

ANN HORVATH: Did your grandmother make special things for you kids when you got there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Everything. Fudge, doughnuts. I remember I ate so many doughnuts, I got sick. And then, I remember my mother drove the tractor.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, yeah?

VIRGINIA LAMB: And Darrell and I sit and play worm seed. You know, the old thing, with the water that’d come down. And then you’d put a plant. And then it would be the next time, it’d be my turn to put a plant, you know what I mean?

JOHN: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: We planted worm seed over there.

ANN HORVATH: When you harvested the worm seed, where did you take it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know. I don’t know that much about that. I don’t know that much about the worm seed. But my father was in worm seeding, one time. I think he had– like, down here on the corner. See, he owned all this 22 lots, in here.

ANN HORVATH: In this Eldersburg area?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Right here.

ANN HORVATH: Right here, where we are now?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, see, it’s part of the Lawson 19 acres. And he had 22 lots in here. Someone told me he had a factory. I don’t know if it was a tomato factory or worm seeds. It’s still down here in the bottom, here on Liberty Road.

I don’t remember– vaguely I remember the old built there. But I don’t remember the tomato factory or anything like that, no. He sold these lots for $300. Front lots, $500.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Well, times change. That’s the way it goes.

JOHN: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: So there were lots of other changes along Liberty Road.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: What about down in Freedom? Do you remember any of the old buildings that you remember seeing?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I remember Mrs. Linton had a store, which is still there.

ANN HORVATH: That building is still there, right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: That building is still there. I think it’s two apartments, now. And Ruth, her daughter, lives in the next house. You know Ruth?

ANN HORVATH: No.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Don’t know Ruth? Yeah. And then, later on, Wills had to meet right there. The Methodist parsonage was in Freedom.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, was it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Which is still there, next to Wills– next to the Wills. That was a school house at one time.

ANN HORVATH: There is a school house there.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. That was Wills. And Fred just passed away last week.

ANN HORVATH: Aw.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Remember he came to the reunion?

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Fritz Wills?

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: 87, he was.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Other than that, that was Freedom, you know.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. Freedom hasn’t changed a lot.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No, it hasn’t changed that much.

ANN HORVATH: But as you go on down south on Liberty Road, down toward Carrollton, and that way.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, Carrollton. Well, farms, farms.

ANN HORVATH: Do you remember the little store?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Fred Neil. Fred Neil had a store on the left, I remember.

ANN HORVATH: What kind of store?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Grocery.

ANN HORVATH: Grocery store?

VIRGINIA LAMB: And at one time, on the other side, Anna Rosa’s father had a bar, on this side. I’m visualizing in my head. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: That’s good. You’re following the line.

JOHN: That’s the best way to do it.

ANN HORVATH: Following the line.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’m visualizing in my head. And if I was down to where you get to McDonald’s, was a school.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Slacks.

ANN HORVATH: Slacks?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Slacks.

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Slacks. And then, it was all fields. Where Carrolltown Mall is was all field. And then we’d get to Rook’s Shop, further down. it’s Smiths now. You know where I mean? Down past, where it used to be Pizza Hut.

ANN HORVATH: OK. Down in the–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Then it’s the tire store. No, no. It’s the school, Slacks. Oklahoma Road, and then there’s a couple houses. And then there was the garage, Rook’s Garage.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And then a couple houses down, [INAUDIBLE] Leatherwood had a little garage in the back of his house.

ANN HORVATH: Well, it’s a little garage, isn’t it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Little garage. No big garage, just little. I remember going down there with my father. And then, over on where [INAUDIBLE] Park is, was Helen Louise Gaither’s home.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know that?

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know that. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: We knew that.

VIRGINIA LAMB: That’s called [INAUDIBLE] Park.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’m getting a little down further, to [INAUDIBLE].

ANN HORVATH: [INAUDIBLE] Corner.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah, down to [INAUDIBLE] Corner.

ANN HORVATH: Did you ever go into the tea room?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. I didn’t know that till George told– up to the spaghetti dinner, I never knew.

ANN HORVATH: You never knew.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: But you remember going on further, on the way to Baltimore.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, I rode the bus. I rode the bus to Baltimore.

ANN HORVATH: And you remember–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Up and past there, yeah. Road past there. But I was never there.

ANN HORVATH: You never were there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I was never there.

ANN HORVATH: Do you remember hearing about Lucky Duck?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I heard about Lucky Duck, but I was never there. No.

ANN HORVATH: They served ice cream or beer or–

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know. I don’t even know who owned it. Do you?

ANN HORVATH: Uh, there were different owners over the time–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Was it?

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. I’m not sure of the names, but.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I do know the Scott Farm was before he–

ANN HORVATH: Before you’d gotten to it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: And then, once you passed that, you were into Baltimore County.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah, then you’re in Baltimore County, yeah.

ANN HORVATH: But it sat down, in the Harlem, in the area that’s–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. And then I remember going up that road, there was a house along the edge. I kept wondering, what keeps it from falling?

[LAUGHTER]

You know, as a Kid, what do you think of it. Why is that so close to the– you know. And then over here was a great, big double story white house. I don’t know who lived there, but I remember that. I remember that.

ANN HORVATH: You were riding the bus?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I was riding the bus. I rode the bus, mhm.

ANN HORVATH: To where?

VIRGINIA LAMB: To Greyhound Terminal.

ANN HORVATH: To go down to Baltimore?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. I worked at Woolworth’s.

ANN HORVATH: You worked at Woolworth’s. When was that?

VIRGINIA LAMB: ’48, 1948. Paid $0.54 an hour.

ANN HORVATH: How long did you work there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Two years.

ANN HORVATH: Two years. And then you came to Springfield?

VIRGINIA LAMB: A bus ticket from Eldersburg to Howard Street was $2.65 for 10 trips.

JOHN: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: $0.26 down, $0.26 back.

JOHN: I remember that old Howard Street in the Woolworth’s.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Do ya?

JOHN: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: I do, too. I do, too, yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I worked there two years, got married. And then I had Robin in ’51. I got married in ’50. Had Robin in ’50. Then I didn’t work for 11 years. Didn’t work for 11 years. I’ve lived here twice.

ANN HORVATH: Twice?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Twice.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. OK. Explain?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I moved here with my mother and father in 1954.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And then I had two children. And we were thinking– he built this house in ’47. And he was 7 years building it. And we moved here in ’54 from up in Eldersburg. And then, in the mean time, he started working on this house, down here.

So I said, sell me that little house. And he was getting up in age at that time. And he said, I’ll do better than that. He said, I’ll sell you the big house. So I bought it. He sold his house to me for $2,000.

ANN HORVATH: Hm. Well.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Didn’t look like this, but it was $2,000, you know.

JOHN: Times have changed.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Times, mhm. Yeah. The windows– well, some of these doors in here are from his– He had a hotel in Westminister on Fort and Main Street.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, really?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh.

ANN HORVATH: What years did he have–

VIRGINIA LAMB: He tore down what’s called Standard Oil or Amoco, I forget which it’s called. Maybe they’re both the same thing. I really don’t know. He leased it to Amoco in 1941 and tore it down.

ANN HORVATH: Was that the great, big old hotel?

VIRGINIA LAMB: It was a hotel.

ANN HORVATH: Right there in–

VIRGINIA LAMB: On Court and Main.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. I know exactly where you mean.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know where I mean?

ANN HORVATH: Across from the Historical Society.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And so, he owned that for a while.

VIRGINIA LAMB: He owned that. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: That’s very interesting.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And he moved all the windows, and the doors, and the flooring and built this house.

ANN HORVATH: And he used this–

VIRGINIA LAMB: He used the windows. These aren’t the windows. But he used all that– the floors upstairs are that wood. My bathroom door and bedroom door are out of there.

ANN HORVATH: Very interesting.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Out of that hotel.

ANN HORVATH: I didn’t realize any of that had been saved.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. And there’s a steel beam across this house, from out of there.

JOHN: Made use of everything.

ANN HORVATH: So about what year did he demolish the–

VIRGINIA LAMB: ’41.

ANN HORVATH: ’41.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And so, then, he–

VIRGINIA LAMB: He released it to them. And was it ’61? 1960 or ’61, I think they bought it. That was in the contract.

ANN HORVATH: But they took the building down? Or the building–

VIRGINIA LAMB: No, he took the building down. He took the building down. And they leased from him for $85 a month.

ANN HORVATH: Did you ever go to Cocky’s Tavern?

No. No, no. No, never went to Cocky’s, no. Never went there.

ANN HORVATH: Did you get into the old hotel much as a child?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. I was only 11.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. You were small.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I was only 11. Mhm. Yeah. I never went into the apartments. He had apartments in there. But as I said, I was only 11 years old.

But I remember it. We’d go to Westminister every Saturday night. Go to Western movies up there at the old State Theater, watch cowboys. I thought when the wagon went off the edge, they were dead.

[LAUGHTER]

So we had to go back the next Saturday night to see if they lived.

ANN HORVATH: Did your grandmother from South Dakota tell you cowboy stories?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. No. She never talked too much about it.

ANN HORVATH: She didn’t talk about her family growing up in South Dakota?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, since you mentioned that, I was 16 at the time. And my father, and Darrell, and the boys made arrangements for her to go to the reunion of her family. She was 79. I was 16. And we left out of Baltimore Airport, on American Airlines, and flew to Brookings, South Dakota.

We went to Chicago. And then we went on a local. A local! Oh my gosh. I thought we’d never get where we were going.

ANN HORVATH: I bet.

VIRGINIA LAMB: So, the family was supposed to meet us in Brookings, where we got off the train. It was looking for an elderly woman and a young girl. We never did– they never did find us. So we got a cab back to Bruce. Bruce, South Dakota, little town.

It was five sisters and a brother. One came from Weiser, Idaho, Minnie. Another one came from Spokane, Washington. Minnie and then Nikolina, that was the one who came from Weiser, Idaho. And then Sophia and Ida lived in South Dakota.

It was 14 of them at one time. 14 of them. And the travelers came through, knocking on the door to stay all night. And they took them in. What they didn’t know, though, they were carriers. What fever? Diphtheria.

ANN HORVATH: Probably.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Diphtheria. Within a week they lost Nikolina and Joseph. When the next daughter was born, it was Nikolina. When the next boy was born, it was Joseph.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Two Nikolinas–

ANN HORVATH: Used the names again?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah. And then, we had a reunion in Sioux Falls. We went into Sioux Falls, South Dakota. It was really nice.

ANN HORVATH: So you got to meet a lot of cousins?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Got to meet a lot, mhm. They didn’t even know each other. The sisters didn’t know one from the other.

ANN HORVATH: Didn’t recognize one another?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Nuh uh. I got their pictures here.

ANN HORVATH: So that was an interesting experience.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. I got their pictures here.

ANN HORVATH: Traveling with your grandmother for such a long distance.

VIRGINIA LAMB: So when I got married and time went by and time went by, we bought a camper. And my husband said, we’re going back to South Dakota. So we left here on Friday night at 6 o’clock. And 9 o’clock, Sunday, we were sitting in Sioux Falls, South Dakota.

ANN HORVATH: OK. [LAUGHS]

VIRGINIA LAMB: So we stayed there. And then, we had a rap, you know, panned out for two weeks. Well, we were going two weeks. But we generally got back here by 12 days. So my grandmother’s nephew was President of the Brookings Bank. So I went in Brookings Bank, and go up to the counter. And he said, may I help you? I said, I’m from Maryland. [LAUGHS] He said, oh my gosh. Oh my gosh.

ANN HORVATH: So he knew you were related.

VIRGINIA LAMB: He didn’t know who I was, but he knew I was related to him, somehow. So then, we had dinner with them that night, him and his family. And then we all went to– where’d we go?

The Canyon, and the Badlands, Mount Rushmore, Crazy Horse, Devils Tower. We went, and it was beautiful. Beautiful. That was our trip out there. We went out a couple times.

ANN HORVATH: So you got to see some of the–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah.

ANN HORVATH: –a couple of times.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And connect with that.

VIRGINIA LAMB: If you ever wanted to see something, you should try to make that trip. It’s absolutely–

JOHN: I have.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Have you made it? Have you?

JOHN: Yeah. The Black Hills and Mount Rushmore–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

JOHN: –down in Nebraska.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Crazy Horse. I don’t think they ever finished it. Or did they finish it?

JOHN: It wasn’t the last time I–

VIRGINIA LAMB: No, it wasn’t.

ANN HORVATH: I don’t think it is.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. See, my husband passed away in ’82. And last we camped was ’80. That’s the last he could make the trip.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. So that was an exciting trip.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: How about back here in Eldersburg? You have three children?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Two.

ANN HORVATH: Two children.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Two children, mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And you have grandchildren?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I have three girls, mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And they all live nearby?

VIRGINIA LAMB: They live in Woodbine. And then one lives in Taylorsville.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: So you have family close by.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And you remember Dr. Lawson?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: And you remember Dr. Lawson’s house?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: Was it a log house? Do you know?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. It’s that house, right there where I showed you.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. My grandmother built that in 1923.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. So the house was built in 1923.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Prior to ’23, was that just an open area?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Don’t know. Don’t know. ’23. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: So it’s built in 1923. In the picture, there’s some out buildings. Did it have a barn that you remember?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know.

ANN HORVATH: Do you remember an orchard?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: How about Holy Trinity Cemetery?

VIRGINIA LAMB: The only thing I remember, going into Dr. Lawson’s is those great, big trees. You remember those big trees that went up into his driveway, and around, and around. But see, later on, when he first opened, his living room was his waiting room.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And then, later on, he built on in the back. And then you went in the back.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. He had an office area.

VIRGINIA LAMB: He had an office in the back, there. Because I used to take my boy. Well, Robin, he’s 58 years old. And he was a baby. I took him up there. But I knew Mrs. Lawson, Billy, and Marcella. They had two children, Billy and Marcella. But other than that– that was in the house.

ANN HORVATH: You don’t remember a barn or trees in the backyard?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: How about Holy Trinity Cemetery? You laid up there, you said, as a child?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I didn’t know it was that much property to Dr. Lawson’s place until– up where the graveyard is, and all that down– I didn’t know it went back that far. I didn’t know it was that much–

ANN HORVATH: There are a lot of trees there.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. I didn’t know it was that much property in the back.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. Didn’t know that.

ANN HORVATH: And how about the cemetery?

VIRGINIA LAMB: The only thing I knew about the cemetery, the roof was caving in. And we were scared to go in there. I do know that. But we’d go up there and play. But we were scared to go inside.

ANN HORVATH: Were there a lot of gravestones there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Yes. Old gates and fences, all falling down. I know it was falling down, and we were scared to go in there. I can still see it, the roof all caved in. You know, visual, I can see that.

ANN HORVATH: It was a stone building, sort of stucco–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah, stucco.

ANN HORVATH: –on the outside?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: And the roof was caving in.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: And it sort of sat at an angle. Did it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know, I was young. I just don’t know. As a kid, we used to go up there. Old weeds and everything, you know. We were afraid of snakes and everything, but we still went anyway. [LAUGHS]

We went up there one night– somebody took me up there one night. What is it called? A scavenger hunt? Is that what it’s called?

JOHN: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And set me up there and left me.

ANN HORVATH: How old were you?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Not smart enough to know what was going on. [LAUGHS] Oh.

ANN HORVATH: Were you scared?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: I bet.

VIRGINIA LAMB: In a way.

ANN HORVATH: But you were close to home.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah. As I say, not smart enough to know what was going on. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: Everybody in the neighborhood probably knew all the neighborhood kids.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. Just sit here a while. It’ll be coming pretty soon, you know what I mean? You’ll see it pretty soon. [LAUGHS] Oh, golly.

ANN HORVATH: Are there other things about Eldersburg that you’d like for people to know and remember?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, I don’t– it was a nice community. Everybody was friendly and nice and just– we just played together. We didn’t know, really.

ANN HORVATH: As you were a child, the roads were not dirt roads anymore.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: They were paved.

VIRGINIA LAMB: They were paved, yeah. But they were dirt roads at one time.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: But I don’t know what year that was. I know in ’36. That’s all I know, that it was paved. But I was going to say, it’s was just a nice little friendly community. We played cowboys and Indians, and sleigh ride.

ANN HORVATH: Where did you go sleigh riding?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Over on this hill, right across the road.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. The road is deep cut in, so the hill isn’t so–

VIRGINIA LAMB: The road is still there that goes into the parish farm. But it’s where all those trees are in the houses up there. And one night I couldn’t go out. I had homework to do.

And that many years ago, when it snowed and was cold, there was a crust. I mean, a crust. And when you put that sled down, you flew. As I said, I couldn’t go out.

So here comes all the kids, running up on the porch. Jenny, Jenny! Jenny, something’s happened. Something happened. One of the guys, the sled got away from him. And he hit that stone wall, over there, and killed him.

ANN HORVATH: Oh my goodness.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yep.

ANN HORVATH: Huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yep. The stone wall is still there.

ANN HORVATH: I wonder what year that was. About how old were you?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’d say 1942, ’43. I was about 12 or 13 years old. Yeah. The stone wall is still there.

ANN HORVATH: Thank goodness for the homework that night, huh?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. It got away from him.

ANN HORVATH: How did you get to school? It’s a good little hike down to Sykesville.

VIRGINIA LAMB: We went down to the corner, Lions’ Lunchroom. When it was cold, we went in the lunchroom. But when it was warm, we said we stayed there on that culvert. There was a culvert there. As you go around that corner there, it was a culvert and a stream.

I don’t know what ever happened to that stream. You have to shut it off, I don’t know. But there was a stream that went down back of it. And we’d sit there on the culvert and wait for the bus when it was warm. And then, in the summertime, nobody had air conditions. So we’d go down there and count cars.

[LAUGHTER]

We didn’t get very far, but we counted cars. It was hot out, you know.

ANN HORVATH: Well, people didn’t have air conditioning.

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. There were no air conditions. You know, the fan, this.

ANN HORVATH: Most people had–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Huh?

ANN HORVATH: Most people had indoor plumbing by that time, but.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, that many years ago, they changed shades. Did you know that?

ANN HORVATH: Yes. Change the shades to winter shades?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

JOHN: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: What did they look like?

VIRGINIA LAMB: The summer shades were green, dark. And then the other shapes were light, for winter. Then people had these things on their porch that rolled up. When the sun came in, then they’d roll that thing down. You know what I mean?

ANN HORVATH: To keep the sun out.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh, keep the sun out.

ANN HORVATH: Did you ever have to sleep out on the porch when it was hot?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. No. But I would sleep at the foot of the bed, with the window.

ANN HORVATH: Sure.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. And then we had a pump to pump water on the back porch. There was no bath.

ANN HORVATH: Did you have an outside bathroom– toilet?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. A whole row of them up there, in Eldersburg. [LAUGHS] One house, Anna Rose’s had a bath. The only bathroom in Eldersburg. And that just amazed me.

ANN HORVATH: How about electricity? When did electricity come through?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh. Well, we had electric there, then. But up in Gist, we didn’t have electricity. Over on the farm, didn’t have electricity. I remember grandma, the one with that lamp, you know, I’d sleep with her.

And we’d go up those big ole steps over there. And she’d have a lantern. What do you call– it was called a lantern, but a lamp. Some called them lanterns, you know. We’d go on up to bed. When the fire went out, the fire went out, you know.

ANN HORVATH: Right. Couldn’t see.

VIRGINIA LAMB: The fire went out. It was cold. And I remember, there were so many covers on the bed, you could hardly turn over. When you woke up the next morning, we’d go downstairs and make a fire.

When the fire got going, you got up. When the fire got going, you’d come back.

ANN HORVATH: You were roasted on one side?

VIRGINIA LAMB: It got hot. Then, we’d push the old rocking chair back. Then you’d get cold. Then we’d push the rocking chair back. [LAUGHS] And I remember her going to Dr. Martin’s, getting ready to go to Dr. Martin’s. I’d go upstairs with her.

ANN HORVATH: Dr. Martin’s office was where?

VIRGINIA LAMB: On Liberty Road. And I remember her putting the curling iron down in the chimney of the lamp, and get it hot. And then, she’d clamp the hair, put that curling iron under the hair to make waves.

ANN HORVATH: To make waves?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

JOHN: What you women went through.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. So she would go down to Dr. Martin?

VIRGINIA LAMB: $0.50.

ANN HORVATH: $0.50?

VIRGINIA LAMB: $0.50. Then he went to a dollar for an office call.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Did he ever come around to visit people’s homes?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I think he did. But I don’t know.

ANN HORVATH: Who delivered the babies?

VIRGINIA LAMB: He delivered babies.

ANN HORVATH: So he did come around, probably, for that?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. But I can’t remember him coming to Eldersburg, which I don’t know. Dr. Lawson delivered babies.

ANN HORVATH: So, probably, he was closer?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Dr. Barnes delivered babies in Sykesville.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, he was down in Sykesville.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Springfield Avenue, Dr. Barnes. His daughter was in my graduate with June, his daughter. And June and Lee Barnes were his daughters. But I remember Dr. Martin. $0.50, you know, it’s hard to believe.

ANN HORVATH: It’s a big difference, yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Hard to believe.

ANN HORVATH: Did you have a drugstore or pharmacy nearby?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Sykesville.

ANN HORVATH: Sykesville?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. None in Eldersburg. No. It was just Lion–

ANN HORVATH: They’re different from today, huh?

VIRGINIA LAMB: It was just Lions’ Lunchroom and Frizzell’s store, and Conaway Garage, there on the corner– or Walgreens. But then I remember, years ago, I think it was ’40, ’41, my father worked for a man named Kinnaman. He had this garage. It was Mulnicks’ Garage.

Ed Mulnicks’ built the garage. He passed away. Anyway, a man by the name of Kinnaman bought the garage. And my father worked for him, selling gas, when it was rationed. And in that garage, it was packed with Studebakers.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Top and bottom of Studebakers. I remember that. You know whether the garage I’m talking about was?

ANN HORVATH: I think so.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Clemons owned it at one time.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Huh?

ANN HORVATH: I’ve heard of it, yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: It’s where the video store, up here, and the pizza place, and before you get to Burger King in there.

ANN HORVATH: Just a little south of 32.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. Yeah. It was a lunchroom– Randall’s Lunchroom and then Randall’s house. And then Dr. Norris. It was Dr. Norris. Which, I didn’t know him, but it was Dr. Norris.

ANN HORVATH: And he was the general practitioner–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Dr. Norris. I just happened to think of that. And then, the Mulnicks’ Garage. Let’s see. Dr. Norris’ house is still there, if I’m not thinking– I’m pretty sure it is. Those changes, you know. It was Dr. Norris. But there was no drugstore.

ANN HORVATH: What do you think was the oldest house in the Eldersburg area?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Let’s see. I really don’t know. There was a house over here called Steele. The name was Steele. Guy Steele–

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know where Somerville is–

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: –in Westminister?

ANN HORVATH: Mhm.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Guy Steele owned that. But then, he had a couple brothers. One was named Hen, Hen Steele. And his sister or brother lived across there– right across the road, here. But that was tore down. Parish built that great, big, beautiful house. They tore that house down.

ANN HORVATH: Parish’s house was not part of that house?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. No. They tore Parish’s house down. They tore my grandma’s house down. And they tore the Bevard. Beautiful, Bevard, where Walmart is.

ANN HORVATH: Were you ever back to the Bevard Farm?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Yes.

ANN HORVATH: Was it big?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. German war prisoners used to work back there when I was a kid.

ANN HORVATH: You remember the German war prisoners being back there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Mr. Bevard had them there on the farm?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah, I remember them. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: About how many were there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know, I don’t know how many were there. But I know they were there.

ANN HORVATH: Young men?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: How old were you?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Nice looking.

[LAUGHTER]

I was that old. I was old enough, then.

ANN HORVATH: Old enough to notice, huh?

JOHN: All us Germans are good looking.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Huh?

JOHN: All us Germans are good looking.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh! I remember that. I couldn’t get over them tearing these homes down.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. They must have– that really changed over time?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Yes. I came home from work one day, and they were burying Parish’s house over here.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Do you remember when they tore down the Holy Trinity Chapel?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. My father painted Parish’s farm.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, did he?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. See, he had a– he owned Hampden Storage, in Baltimore.

ANN HORVATH: OK. I didn’t know–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Carpet, Hampden Rug and Storage.

ANN HORVATH: They cleaned and stored rugs.

VIRGINIA LAMB: We had two or three warehouses over here, in the back of the home, great, big warehouses. And my father painted that whole farm for him.

ANN HORVATH: Huh.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. It was a beautiful farm. So I was going to say, they tore– tore all those homes down. And then, later on, we got a store, another store, on 32, which is the Ugly Mug, now. It was Wolbert’s– Wolbert. He had a hardware and a groc– then, later on, it became Rudnick’s. And that’s when you probably know of it.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Rudnick’s. Johnny Rudnick.

ANN HORVATH: Is that what his name was?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh. Yeah. He had a store there. That was there a good while. And other than that, then– I’m trying to think of what else, but. Then that big building, up here on the corner, my cousin owned that, [INAUDIBLE].

ANN HORVATH: Which corner?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, Bartholow, where Jeff Barnes has all his cars parked.

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: That was a big apartment house, up there. And then there was a store under there. At one time, there was a store under there, when I was a kid. And then, there’s apartments upstairs. Richardson’s, Dan and Alice lived in one, and Polly and Carol Eli.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Polly Eli.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Polly Eli. [INAUDIBLE] are her two children. Ring a bell?

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. Some of those names do, yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Then there was an old well there.

ANN HORVATH: Yes. Tell me about the well.

VIRGINIA LAMB: The well.

ANN HORVATH: The well has a lot of history to it.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, Anna Rose and I were sitting in Bob Evans one day. And we looked out the window. And we looked across the road, and we saw this thing sticking out of the ground. Anna Rose said, Jenny, I think that’s– I think that’s that old well! I said, sure looks like a well to me. And I remember it being, you know, you had to wind it, you know. And Anna Rose started asking questions. It’s not the well.

ANN HORVATH: No. It’s part of–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Huh?

ANN HORVATH: It’s part of the water system, I think it is.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Is that what it is?

ANN HORVATH: I think so.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know. It’s not the well.

ANN HORVATH: But it’s in the spot, about, where the well might have been.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Is it?

ANN HORVATH: I think so.

VIRGINIA LAMB: OK.

ANN HORVATH: I think so.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I thought–

ANN HORVATH: That’s one reason you all would think that it might have been the well.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah, I thought it was. And then, Raymond Grimes, he dealt in cattle. You’ve probably heard of him, in the next house over. But it just sits up on the bank up there.

And then Cagle, Mr. Cagle, he had Cagle’s TV. He started out there. And then, later on, he went up to the shopping center. Bob Cagle and Buddy Cagle, you know them.

ANN HORVATH: I know of them. I know they were business men in Eldersburg.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. And Bernie Goodman, he worked for him about 40, 50 years, Bernie Goodman.

ANN HORVATH: Heard of him, too.

VIRGINIA LAMB: He worked for Cagle. Yeah. That’s where he started out, up there.

ANN HORVATH: A lot of interesting people in Eldersburg.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah, it is. Lot of nice people. I just, you know, could talk about day to people about everything.

ANN HORVATH: So you still see some of your old friends? Like Anna Rose’s basement?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. But I am, and my three cousins– Joanne, who lives up here on the next Exxon– are about the only people left.

ANN HORVATH: That are true Eldersburg–

VIRGINIA LAMB: That are truly Eldersburg.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: They’re all gone. They’re all gone. So, I was going to say, I have three cousins that live there in that brick rancher, up on the bank. But that’s Bob Randall’s niece’s. Their mother was Bob’s sister, like I showed you on there. Other than that, Elders– they’re all going.

ANN HORVATH: Any special memories of Sykesville, besides going to the movies?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I remember seeing Happy Johnny down there one night.

[LAUGHTER]

I remember it caught on fire one night.

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I remember it caught on fire, up in that old theater. See, we’d catch Mr. Gardner. When he closed his fill station up here, 7 o’clock, we’d ride to Sykesville with him. And where Elder Care is was his home.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And he’d drop us off there. And we’d walk down and go to movies. So my father would come get us one night– one week. And Jean Conaway Bill’s mother, they’d come get us the next night. But what we’d do, we wouldn’t wait till the movie was over. We’d go up to Ken Barnes’, where there was a jukebox, and look for boys, you know.

[LAUGHTER]

But when 11 o’clock came, we were standing down on Main Street.

ANN HORVATH: Where you were supposed to be.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Where we were supposed to be, waiting to be picked up.

ANN HORVATH: How about your visits to Westminister? You went to the movies?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah. Went to Westminister. Every Saturday night we went to Westminister.

ANN HORVATH: And you went to the movies. Any other things that you did in Westminister?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: You went to Westminister to visit your family?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Anna Rose would go with us sometimes, and Jean would go with us sometimes. And then we went in Murphy’s, look at the jewelry. Oh, I said, oh, isn’t that pretty? Isn’t that pretty? And I’d buy this ring.

ANN HORVATH: What else do you remember about–

VIRGINIA LAMB: About three days later, my ring finger was green.

[LAUGHTER]

ANN HORVATH: What else do you remember about Murphy’s? Do you remember the change going back?

VIRGINIA LAMB: That was Penny’s.

ANN HORVATH: That was Penny’s?

VIRGINIA LAMB: That was Penny’s.

ANN HORVATH: OK. I wasn’t sure which one.

VIRGINIA LAMB: It was Penny’s. Mhm. Yes, I remember that.

ANN HORVATH: So you went to Pennys once in a while.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. Oh yeah, went to Pennys.

ANN HORVATH: How about Mathers?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I went to Pennys. They put it in the thing, you know. Then they pull this chain, and it would go up to the balcony, the money. Then the change would come back down in that little brown thing, you know.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. The little container.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. Little container they put the top on. And then, Harry’s Lunch– the first Harry’s Lunch was next to there, too, on Main Street, next to the State Theater. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: So you’d go there sometimes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah. I went there.

ANN HORVATH: What about Mathers? Did you go there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’ve been to Mathers and [INAUDIBLE] and Fischer’s and Rosenstocks, they were there. And when I first got out of school, I went to work at the sewing factory there on Main Street, in the old opera house.

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. That was a hard job.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, they put me on sewing flies in men’s pants, in the middle of June. These wool–

ANN HORVATH: Wool pants.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. I got so hot, I couldn’t stand it in there. So anyway, my girlfriend I, we left there. So I went to the shoe factory and got a job. I worked there a year.

ANN HORVATH: Where was the shoe factory?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Right there on Green and Main, across from Mackeys. Mackeys?

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. Right across from Mackeys, yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. So they closed down for two weeks for vacation. So I said, I gotta get out of here. So I went in town, got me a job at Woolworth’s.

ANN HORVATH: Woolworth’s, ah. Very interesting.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah. Because I worked there for over two years. Yeah. I can still see the bell ringing, you know, the Salvation Army. Snowing, you know. I had first 10 seats of the counter. That was down front.

And then, I remember– I often wondered what happened to the laughing Santa Claus.

ANN HORVATH: The laughing Santa Claus?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Did you ever see the laughing Santa Claus?

JOHN: No, I didn’t.

ANN HORVATH: No, me either.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Hoshall’s. Hoshall’s or Hutsler’s. I believe it was Hoshall’s up Lexington Street. May Company was here.

JOHN: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And it was over here, on the corner. And they had this laughing Santa Claus. He’d go, ho, ho, ho, ho. Ho, ho. Like this, in the window.

JOHN: I think I do remember.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And then, later on, they added Mrs. Santa Claus. Wonder what ever happened to them.

JOHN: I don’t know. But all those windows in those department stores were all decorated at Christmas time.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Beautiful.

ANN HORVATH: They were beautiful.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Beautiful. And then, Leon Levy’s was next, the jewelry store. Oh, boy, was that something. That was something.

ANN HORVATH: Something to go in and walk around.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. It was nice. And then, when I got off, on Thursday night– I had to work till 8:30. And I wasn’t married, then. Tommy, he’d come and he’d pick me up. And we’d go up to the Hippodrome.

JOHN: I spent many a-day there.

VIRGINIA LAMB: The Hippodrome. We’d go there. And I’m glad they renovated the Hippodrome. And then, Lexington Market’s there. That was nice to go through. But then it was Brager-Eisenberg, Butlins.

ANN HORVATH: Lots of interesting departments stores.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Grants. I can name them right off. There was Stewart’s, Grants, Castlegar, Ann Lewis, Kresge, Gutman’s, right on up Main.

ANN HORVATH: You just see them right in your head.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. McRory’s, Reed’s, on the corner.

ANN HORVATH: Reed’s.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Reed’s. And then you go down further, it’s the gas and electric. And then, up on this side was the Century and Valencia Theaters, going up towards Charles Street.

JOHN: Yeah. Going down Lexington.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. Yeah. Gutman’s used to have a dollar day. Oh. A woman got her broke in there. She come in the store. [LAUGHS] She’d been to the dollar days and had her arm broke.

ANN HORVATH: [LAUGHS] Trying to get a bargain.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Trying to get a bargain, yeah. Yeah. They were something. A cup of coffee was $0.05.

ANN HORVATH: How long did it take you to get from out here into Baltimore, on the bus?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I caught the bus at 20 after 7 and got home 20 after 6. I had to stand up most of the way. You know, jerking, jerking, jerking, stopping. Guys wouldn’t give you a seat.

[LAUGHTER]

JOHN: Probably about an hour ride in, wasn’t it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: About 45 minutes.

JOHN: 45 minutes to an hour.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah. We picked up a bunch of girls at Ward’s Chapel and on down.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. A lot of women rode the bus, than now.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: What about in bad weather?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Still rode the bus.

ANN HORVATH: The bus still went.

VIRGINIA LAMB: It still went. Yeah. And then there was another bus that came from Fredrick. And that was later. If I missed the bus at 20 after 5, I could catch one at quarter to 6. There were two of them coming out of there. But I would have to go upstairs and change my clothes, from the uniform to my street clothes.

At 5 o’clock, I got off. To go up Paris Street, to catch that bus at 25 after 5–

ANN HORVATH: You didn’t have much time.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Didn’t have much time. It was moving. Yeah. And the bus would be full when I got there. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. Because you couldn’t get there earlier.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I couldn’t get there earlier, no. But those were what you call the good old days.

ANN HORVATH: When you worked at Springfield, did you work long hours like that?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: No? More of an 8-hour day?

VIRGINIA LAMB: 7. 7 to 3:30. Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. Went there in 1962.

ANN HORVATH: Was it kind of at maximum capacity during those years?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, there were 3,200 patients there, then. Nice, nice. Very nice.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Very nice, the work. Best move I ever made.

ANN HORVATH: Close to home.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Good benefits.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Good benefits.

ANN HORVATH: Good salary for you, compared to–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. The benefits were better than the salary. But it was nice. Best move I ever made, for pension and everything, benefits.

ANN HORVATH: And I’m sure you knew lots of the people that worked–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know me. [LAUGHS] My cousin told me to report her.

[LAUGHTER]

JOHN: I’m almost out of tape on this one.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

JOHN: So I’m going to have the chance to.

ANN HORVATH: That’s OK. We can stop.

JOHN: We got another one. It’ll only take 30 seconds.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh.

ANN HORVATH: Well, I wasn’t sure where you were.

JOHN: And maybe, what we’ll do, when we come back–

ANN HORVATH: Is get some of these pictures.

JOHN: –is continue with some of these pictures. And I’ll try to zoom in on the pictures.

VIRGINIA LAMB: OK. Whatever.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. That sounds like a good idea. Huh. I know they got some of those photographs from down at the Gate House Museum. But now, I don’t know where they got–

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’ve got to go over there. I’ve never been over there.

ANN HORVATH: Talk to Carrie about that.

VIRGINIA LAMB: We can’t figure how or who got that picture. As you come in the door–

JOHN: Yeah?

ANN HORVATH: Uh huh. Down at McDonald’s, right down the road, here, they’ve got really nice photographs on the wall.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And she’s standing on Liberty Road. The original Liberty Road, she’s standing on it.

ANN HORVATH: Is that what she’s standing on?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: They’ve got these old pictures. And they’ve got some up here, at Bob Evans, too.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. Yes.

ANN HORVATH: Some nice, old pictures.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes.

ANN HORVATH: And I think the person who took care of that contract with McDonald’s got them from down at the Gate House, but that’s all I know. And now, how the Gate House got–

VIRGINIA LAMB: We have tried and tried to find that–

ANN HORVATH: But you took that picture?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I took that picture.

ANN HORVATH: And you still have your original?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I took that picture with an old one. They called them 120 Brownie, little box. Took nice pictures. I got loads of pictures taken with that little camera.

You know, you’d fill in the thing, and then you look in hole. You know what I mean? You click like, you know? [LAUGHS] Huh?

ANN HORVATH: The black and white, that’d stand out really well.

JOHN: Then you’d have to wind it for the next–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Huh?

JOHN: Then you’d have to wind it up for the next–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Wind. And then, you’ll close it up. And then you look in a little square, you know what I mean. You’d get in that little square. And then you’d, click, click. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. Good pictures, yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Robin, my son, his wife, ‘ she collects everything. Which is good. She’s got that camera. I didn’t know where it was.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, well that’s good that somebody saved–

VIRGINIA LAMB: I lost track of it, you know what I mean, over the years. And it was in my father’s desk, down here. I give him the furniture out of there. He was an antique collector, Daddy was.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, was he?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. And it was in that desk. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: He was into a lot of different things.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. I’ve got a sewing machine here that my grandmother gave me. It’s a Singer. [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: I bet it still works.

VIRGINIA LAMB: It does.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. They never stop working, I don’t think. All right. What pictures do you want, John?

JOHN: Just whatever. We can start with that one. And if you can–

ANN HORVATH: OK. And just tell her–

JOHN: If you can hold it up, I can zoom in on it, then.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Let me get out of the way, here.

JOHN: No, no.

ANN HORVATH: You hold it up. Yeah, you can sit back down.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, OK.

ANN HORVATH: Just hold it up.

JOHN: Just sit there and hold it up out in front of you–

ANN HORVATH: And I’ll pass you another one.

JOHN: –without blocking your face. You don’t have to hide.

[LAUGHTER]

ANN HORVATH: She’s being very mischievous.

JOHN: OK. Now, tell me something about that picture. Don’t know anything about that picture?

ANN HORVATH: But you know this is the–

VIRGINIA LAMB: I know it’s the Lucky Duck Inn. I know that.

ANN HORVATH: And it was down under what is now Liberty.

VIRGINIA LAMB: It’s underwater.

ANN HORVATH: Yep.

JOHN: OK. And let’s see some of the others.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’d love to know who they are on the back.

ANN HORVATH: These are the– well, let’s just– Take that. You want to hold that up.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Love to know who they are.

ANN HORVATH: This we know is Sykesville School.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You don’t know what year?

ANN HORVATH: But we are unsure of the year. And it’s before the second floor was put on. So we sort of guessed at by the clothing the children are wearing. But we can’t identify any of the people. So, if anyone knows.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Isn’t that something? I’d love to know who that’s up there to Bob Evans. It’s 1901, so it’s going to be hard to find somebody.

ANN HORVATH: OK. This is a picture from your collection, if you want to tell us a little bit about the house.

VIRGINIA LAMB: My grandmother built this in 1923.

ANN HORVATH: OK. And her name was?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Annie M. Harris.

ANN HORVATH: And the gentlemen standing–

VIRGINIA LAMB: This is my father, Herman. And it was originally sold to Dr. Lawson.

ANN HORVATH: And about what year did Dr. Lawson get there, roughly?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know.

JOHN: That’s OK.

ANN HORVATH: Did you ever sleep there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No.

ANN HORVATH: No?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh uh. No. I say I was– it was Dr. Law– 1930. Well, that’s when I was born. That’s all I know.

ANN HORVATH: OK. Tell us about this interesting picture.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. This is my grandfather, William Harris.

JOHN: Turn it back, though. I’ve got the light– yeah, that’s better.

ANN HORVATH: Got it.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And Grandmother, Annie. My father, Herman. My Uncle Bill, Darrell, and James, 1911.

ANN HORVATH: And the occasion for this picture was?

VIRGINIA LAMB: That’s the Badlands, coming across the Badlands.

ANN HORVATH: They were leaving there?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: And they traveled in this wagon, all the way across–

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know how far they came. But they came across. You see the hats on the horses?

ANN HORVATH: Yes.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Do you see the hats? [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: OK. One more.

VIRGINIA LAMB: This is ’26 and ’32. Let’s see. 19–

ANN HORVATH: Here in Eldersburg.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’m trying to think what year.

ANN HORVATH: In about what year?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, what year car would you say that is?

JOHN: If you’re asking a 401 for cars, it’s probably a 1920-something.

VIRGINIA LAMB: ’29?

JOHN: Maybe earlier than that.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Earlier than than that? There’s the year, if you’ve got some eyes that can see that year.

ANN HORVATH: It’s just a little bit blurry. But it is the– tell us which building.

VIRGINIA LAMB: This is the original Randall’s. This is Randall’s Lunchroom.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And it later became Lions’. Denny Lions’ Lunchroom, originally.

ANN HORVATH: And the people in the picture?

VIRGINIA LAMB: This is Ted Randall, Bob Randall, Dorothy Harris, Marie Conaway, and Mr. Harry Myers.

ANN HORVATH: And the dog?

VIRGINIA LAMB: And this is Teddy. I remember Teddy.

ANN HORVATH: You do?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh. Vaguely.

JOHN: Angle the picture back towards you. I need to–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Vaguely, I remember Teddy.

JOHN: A little bit more. Back to– yeah. That’s perfect. That’s perfect, thank you.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Look at the watering can. Look at the watering can for water.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: To put in your radiator.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. Did you go here often for–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Yeah, as kids. Jukebox.

ANN HORVATH: Jukebox–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Whoa, whoa, when they got the Jukebox– oh, when they got the Jukebox, that was something else, now.

[LAUGHTER]

ANN HORVATH: You mean, technology was important then, too, wasn’t it?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. I think it was a nickel. A nickel. Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Do you have some other pictures you’d like to share with us?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, I have other pictures upstairs.

ANN HORVATH: You a couple in your album that were a little bit different.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You’re welcome.

ANN HORVATH: We’ll take a look.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Let’s see.

JOHN: Watch it. You’re wired.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh. I was going to get up.

ANN HORVATH: No. That’s OK. There were a here that I thought were special.

VIRGINIA LAMB: My mother and grandfather.

ANN HORVATH: And their names were?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Grimes.

ANN HORVATH: These are the Grimes ancestors. And this picture was taken at the Grimes Farms?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh. On Old Washington Road.

JOHN: If you can kind of hold it like that.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. See, when I’m looking at it from here.

JOHN: Yeah. Let’s see. I think that takes–

ANN HORVATH: I could even take this one out, John.

JOHN: Yeah. It’s OK like that.

VIRGINIA LAMB: [LAUGHS] This is the old one.

ANN HORVATH: I’m going to take this out.

VIRGINIA LAMB: There’s the– and how old is that?

JOHN: I’m bet it’s well over 100.

ANN HORVATH: That is adorable. A child’s sewing machine.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Let’s see. This one–

ANN HORVATH: Do you have your microphone? Do you need her mic?

JOHN: Just like that will be fine.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: We give an estimate around ’49 or ’50.

ANN HORVATH: And it is Lions’ Lunchroom?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. That was a carry-out, then, that many years ago. But this is Lions’ Lunchroom on that corner. See, it used to be over here, of that picture.

ANN HORVATH: Right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: See?

ANN HORVATH: It would on the other side.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. This is the Gardner’s. George Gardner and Dick run this filling station.

ANN HORVATH: And there’s a man in the–

VIRGINIA LAMB: I know. I don’t know who it is.

ANN HORVATH: You’re not sure who it is?

VIRGINIA LAMB: No. If I’m not mistaken– is at 50-something car?

ANN HORVATH: I would say that’s about a ’54.

VIRGINIA LAMB: That’s 26 and 32. This is 26, right here. Oh, the carryout wasn’t there then. The carryout later went there.

ANN HORVATH: Mhm. OK. And then, tell us about the people in this picture.

VIRGINIA LAMB: This is my grandmother and grandfather, William and Annie Harris, with their four sons, Bill, Darrell, Herman, and James.

ANN HORVATH: Now, they’re in a tent. So you’re thinking they were on their way across country?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yes. They’re eating. There’s the coffee pot, you know. That’s food in the dishes. I wonder what it is. Isn’t that something?

ANN HORVATH: It looks like all tin dishes?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: Like camping kinds of equipment. And so, they came East because?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Health.

ANN HORVATH: His health?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Ill health, yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. He had black lung–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Black lung.

ANN HORVATH: –or something like that.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. They’re buried up here.

ANN HORVATH: OK. Up here at–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Old Freedom.

ANN HORVATH: Old Freedom. OK. Had he been a smoker? Or had he been exposed to–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, no.

ANN HORVATH: And about what year did he die?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I think he passed away when my father was eight.

ANN HORVATH: OK. So he died–

VIRGINIA LAMB: My father was born in 1898.

ANN HORVATH: So it wasn’t long after this photograph that he died?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: And Annie?

VIRGINIA LAMB: She died in 1965.

ANN HORVATH: So she lived for a long time.

VIRGINIA LAMB: She was born in 1865 and died in 1964.

ANN HORVATH: She saw a lot of changes in her life. She must have been an interesting woman to talk to.

VIRGINIA LAMB: “The Sun” paper, or “News-Post,” I forget which it was, came to interview her, up in Eldersburg, up to Darrell’s.

ANN HORVATH: Here was a woman who’d come across the country in a wagon.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah.

ANN HORVATH: Raised a family, right here.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Right. They said she got mad at her father.

ANN HORVATH: She got mad at her father. [LAUGHS] OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: So I don’t know. Just what I hear, you know what I mean? She was something else. She was something. Annie Matilda.

ANN HORVATH: Annie Matilda Nelson.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Oh, yes I did see Pet Milk, here, if I’m not mistaken. Is that Pet Milk?

ANN HORVATH: Yep, it is. P-E-T. I can see it too.

VIRGINIA LAMB: [LAUGHS]

ANN HORVATH: Yep. So, it’s very hard to see, but there is definitely a can of Pepto-Bismol.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Isn’t that something?

ANN HORVATH: With the coffee pot, the metal dishes. The dishes do have food in them. Cups full of water or milk for the children, it looks like.

VIRGINIA LAMB: She educated all those boys. Well, the one, a horse kicked him, James, and killed him. Young.

ANN HORVATH: Young.

VIRGINIA LAMB: But she educated all these boys. Darrell was an artist at Maryland Institute of Art.

ANN HORVATH: Wow.

VIRGINIA LAMB: And one of his girls, Joanne, up there in that house, went to the same school. And my father went to Rock Hill College in Ellicott City.

ANN HORVATH: Oh, wow. Yeah.

VIRGINIA LAMB: You know where I mean?

ANN HORVATH: I know that–

VIRGINIA LAMB: Sits up on that– way, way up.

ANN HORVATH: On a hill.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. And Bill, he was in music. She educated them.

ANN HORVATH: So they were talented.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Yeah. She raised them.

ANN HORVATH: What was she like?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Nice. Nicest–

ANN HORVATH: Did she have artistic talent of her own?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Nicest person you ever– I just loved her.

ANN HORVATH: Did she have artistic talent of her own? Did she draw or love music?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Cook.

ANN HORVATH: Cook.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Cook.

ANN HORVATH: Cook.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Cook!

ANN HORVATH: How about him, do you know?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Don’t know.

ANN HORVATH: Had other talents?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Don’t know.

ANN HORVATH: Died too soon.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm. Don’t know. They’re all buried up here at Wesley, old Wes– on the old church. The old graveyard.

ANN HORVATH: All right.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I didn’t know James. Never got to meet James.

ANN HORVATH: Where did the accident happen?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Don’t know?

ANN HORVATH: Out West? Out in the Dakotas?

VIRGINIA LAMB: I don’t know.

ANN HORVATH: It looks like he made the trip East.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I know. Now, let me see. My mother had a brother. One was kicked by a horse. And the other died of something, something. He may have died of something else, and Herbert may have been kicked by a horse. I just don’t know which one of it was.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah. Well, it’s easy to get those mixed up when you don’t know them.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: OK. Well, thank you very much.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh.

ANN HORVATH: We very much enjoyed our visit with you today.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I’m trying to think how much he got for an acre. 2,200 acres.

ANN HORVATH: Out in South Dakota?

VIRGINIA LAMB: Does a nickel sound– nickel don’t sound right, does it?

JOHN: It could be, out there at that time.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I think so.

ANN HORVATH: It wasn’t much.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Uh huh. I think a nickel, I think I heard him say.

ANN HORVATH: Enough to getting him back here, and that’s about it.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Well, he must have– she educated all the boys and bought property, you know what I mean?

ANN HORVATH: So many took the opportunity to make a life here for themself.

VIRGINIA LAMB: Mhm.

ANN HORVATH: OK.

VIRGINIA LAMB: I mean, look, they were all dressed nice, you know what I mean, and everything. And even the mules had hats on.

[LAUGHTER]

ANN HORVATH: All right. Well, thank you again.

VIRGINIA LAMB: All right. You’re welcome. Any more questions? I’m glad to answer them.

JOHN: No, ma’am. Thank you very much. We really enjoyed this, both of us.

ANN HORVATH: Yeah.

JOHN: We’ll wrap this all up.